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so here's my interview with staiin

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Friedman I don't have any video for this

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one I'm gonna have some more video

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coming up soon

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you know what I really want accomplished

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in this interview is kind of clear up

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this idea of the consciousness UFO angle

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and I've been pounding on this a little

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bit cuz I talked to Jack away a few

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episodes back you remember and you know

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he's the guy who's always associated

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with expanding UFOs beyond this

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nuts-and-bolts technology thing and

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looking at you know quite appropriately

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looking at consciousness angle and you

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know does this relate to fairies and

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folklore and even near-death experience

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psychedelic experience oh that's of

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great UFO consciousness great great

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great great but what I want to do is

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connect Stan Friedman to this because I

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think Stan Friedan's right in the middle

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of all that and has just kind of a

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slightly different angle but there's a

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lot of similarities between what he's

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saying and yet they're kind of pitted

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against each other and I don't think

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Jacques Vallee is as consciousness

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centered as people think and I don't

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think Stan Friedman is quoted quite as

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nuts and bolts centered so that's one of

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the themes that I explored in this

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interview with Stan Friedman so

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augmented reality is going to help us

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mix the digital the physical and all new

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ways and that's gonna make our physical

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reality better so that's why this is

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such an important trend that's Facebook

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CEO Mark Zuckerberg spreading the

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Facebook's brave new world gospel

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regarding the merging of consciousness

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and computing actually if you listen to

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a bunch of the things that he said out

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there on various interviews and whatnot

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he's actually taking his foot off the

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pedal a little bit with this group of

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developers in other videos he

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straight-up talks about mind-reading

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telepathy and even mind control is all

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being part of Facebook's glorious future

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and you know what he might be right now

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of course you know skeptical always been

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about controversial science and

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spirituality related to consciousness

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and that doesn't always mix

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perfectly with technology but if we're

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gonna be honest we have to accept that

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technology has a fantastic role to play

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in cutting through some of the

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philosophical

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that sometimes dominates the spiritual

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and even the consciousness discussions I

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mean when there's a mind-reading app you

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can download for your iPhone 20 some of

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the spiritual questions surrounding

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consciousness will no longer seem

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relevant and if I can make a bit of a

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leap here the same goes for UFOs the

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main question that seems to have

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dominated the UFO field for the last 10

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years is whether we should remain

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focused on nuts-and-bolts technology

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sightings landings that kind of stuff or

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whether we should shift the focus to

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experiences and experience earth and as

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you know in that realm science is thrown

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out the window it's all about the

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idiosyncratic phenomenology of what you

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experienced and of course dr. jacques

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valet has been a leading thinker of this

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area and his ideas about linking

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extended consciousness realms to the UFO

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phenomenon are kind of well documented

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and well deserved and I of course

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covered this topic recently in my

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interview with valet and also an

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interview I had previously with Robbie

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Graham but since I hadn't heard from

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anyone in the nuts-and-bolts camp I

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decided to turn to my old buddy Stanton

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Friedman because here's a guy who's been

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around for so long and I think he's been

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unfairly characterized and unfairly cast

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aside if you will in this discussion

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about UFOs and consciousness so Stan and

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I talked about a number of things one of

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those is the

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technology angle as it relates to

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consciousness which is really a great

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point that I haven't really talked about

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before and I'm really glad that Stan

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brought it up here's a clip that I think

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gets at that when I go through all those

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I continue to get the characterization

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of Stan Friedman as he's a guy who's

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just interested in nuts and bolts and

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the UFO field has moved on and it's

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interested in experiences and

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experiencers

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one how do you feel about both how

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you're being characterized there and how

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the field is being characterized and

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whether the field has and should move

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from worrying about nuts and bolts

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sightings and that kind of stuff to

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being interested in experiences and

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experiences look I'm co-author of the

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book captured the Betty and Barney Hill

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UFO experience and I'm certainly

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convinced not only that the event took

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place as described in the book but that

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there's a lot going on there and that

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isn't really conventional I'm convinced

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that there is another aspect of the

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phenomena that's very important call it

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not just telepathy but being able to

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control other people being able to exert

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control over parts of the physics world

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physical world that we don't really know

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how to deal with like I say when I hear

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about people who I've listened to tapes

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of people reliving the experience of

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watching aliens go through the walls and

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it's scary stick around all that in much

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more from Stan Friedman today on

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skeptical

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today we welcome famous UFO researcher

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author and nuclear physicist Stanton

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Friedman back to skeptic Oh Stan is one

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of the absolute Giants in the field of

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UFO research I'm sure many of you know

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that already but just in case you didn't

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I mean we're talking hundreds and

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hundreds of TV appearances radio

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appearances thousands of lectures around

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the world and of course several books

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and many important articles

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he's has just such a vast broad

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knowledge of a lot of different aspects

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of UFO research even some of the ones

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that we're most interested here on

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skeptic Oh in terms of the overlay with

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consciousness science and some frontier

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science so I'm really looking forward to

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this conversation Stan welcome back

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great to have you here great to be on

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again I love doing radio I don't need to

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wear a tie you know before we even get

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started I wanted to mention because we

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had an email exchange and I'll talk more

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about that later but in the email

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exchange you reminded me of the nuclear

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physicist part which is an important

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part of your background you lived that

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world for quite a while and more deniers

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and you reminded me by looking at your

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bio that you know you were right there

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with the military-industrial complex

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giants McDonnell Douglas TR W

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Westinghouse you know we could say you

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were like Greg yeah yeah you were deep

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state before we call the deep state or

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at least you are part of that whole that

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whole machine whatwhat did you have a

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sense of that back then you know well I

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was excited my first job out of school

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I'm working for General Electric

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aircraft nuclear propulsion Department

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and hearten great guys to work with the

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work was classified but I was involved

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in a number of experiments I got a

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chance to meet a lot of good people and

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publish papers do stuff like that I

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thought I'd spend my life with them

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it didn't turn out that way because as

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with many other programs mine got

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canceled you know it's kind of crazy how

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things go up and down in the in the

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military of the Rd world Gea MP aircraft

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missile propulsion in 1958 we employed

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3400 people of whom 1,100 were engineers

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and scientists and we spent that year

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100 million dollars when that was a lot

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of money so we're not talking about a

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few professors and a couple of grad

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students sitting around a big table I

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did experiments and several different

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places it was exciting prick kid fresh

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out of school you know University of

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Chicago Carl Sagan of our classmates for

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three years he went he chose the right

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time to go for a PhD in astronomy

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because Sputnik went up and 57 and had

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certainly excited the world and the

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politicians because they're Russians

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were beaten ACK the United States at

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that time in space you know so some of

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those programs were reused

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somewhere exciting almost all were

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cancelled right you know I had a little

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bit of an experience with that when I

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got out of school I was actually while I

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was still in school I was studying for a

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PhD in artificial intelligence and that

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was of interest to Texas Instruments at

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the time I always remember being there

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and having two thirds virtually of this

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huge complex being walled off behind a

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glass wall that you know only people

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with these special badges but getting

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little glimpses and chats with them you

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know oh it's remember this one gold

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badger you know that was as your badge

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progressed you've got these different

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colors and the gold was the highest

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remember talking to this guy at lunch

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and asking him you know what he did I

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was completely naive completely naive

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kid you know in college and he said I've

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always been around death and destruction

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my whole life and I guess that's how

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always will be and then he kind of

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disappeared again behind that glass wall

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so I I think what you bring to that just

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in talking about it and I think in

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general your research and what you've

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brought to this field is a certain

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grounding of hey guys there's a reality

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to that this stuff happens some of it is

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pretty deep and dark like you hear of it

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but some of it and like what I just

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heard you say some of it's very ordinary

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stuff it's about making proposals about

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getting budgets about you know been

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spending those budgets fulfilling those

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commitments or not you know I mean do

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you ever think it's fun and fun but but

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do you ever think about that in terms of

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this world that you're in the UFO world

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in terms of maybe a gap in terms of what

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people understand about how these worlds

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can simultaneously exist yet is the

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world of the deep state you know the

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scary deep state and the world of hey

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just some really smart engineers trying

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to solve a problem

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well yeah I'm concerned about that and

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I'm concerned that people I get people

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tell me these days oh you can't keep

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secrets about anything Stan with the

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internet and so forth and that's my

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market you can keep secrets look the

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Lockheed program to develop stealth

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aircraft they spent 10 billion dollars

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in 10 years in secret the first spy

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satellite for the United States was the

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corona spy satellite in the late 50s

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early 60s there were 12 failures and

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before they had a successful one all in

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secret the 13th one got more data about

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Soviet military installations then all

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the u2 flights that had preceded it they

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kept going at that and for another 30

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years there were corona spy satellites

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all in secret nobody know about it

276
00:13:15,460 --> 00:13:12,050
you know that's the way it is and people

277
00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:15,470
should remember that keeping secrets is

278
00:13:21,220 --> 00:13:18,290
primarily a national security kind of

279
00:13:23,650 --> 00:13:21,230
concern why should we let our enemies

280
00:13:25,720 --> 00:13:23,660
know what we're capable of when they're

281
00:13:29,019 --> 00:13:25,730
not letting us know what they're capable

282
00:13:30,579 --> 00:13:29,029
of in other words every country on the

283
00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:30,589
planet would love to be able to

284
00:13:35,110 --> 00:13:32,450
duplicate a flying saucer wouldn't they

285
00:13:38,290 --> 00:13:35,120
the flight capability you know up down

286
00:13:41,199 --> 00:13:38,300
back forth right IO turns etc etc silent

287
00:13:43,569 --> 00:13:41,209
wait okay yeah everybody would like to

288
00:13:46,300 --> 00:13:43,579
be able to build one so we've recovered

289
00:13:48,910 --> 00:13:46,310
several I'm sure the Russians have too

290
00:13:50,500 --> 00:13:48,920
but why should we put out what we have

291
00:13:52,780 --> 00:13:50,510
learned if they don't put out what they

292
00:13:57,910 --> 00:13:52,790
have learned you know this is a world

293
00:14:00,460 --> 00:13:57,920
this year terrible term but this year we

294
00:14:02,530 --> 00:14:00,470
will spend we nice-guy Earthlings will

295
00:14:05,319 --> 00:14:02,540
spend a trillion dollars on things

296
00:14:08,560 --> 00:14:05,329
military that gives you some kind of

297
00:14:12,190 --> 00:14:08,570
clue that that's considered important we

298
00:14:14,439 --> 00:14:12,200
live in a dangerous world and so we need

299
00:14:17,199 --> 00:14:14,449
to take that into account secrets can be

300
00:14:19,509 --> 00:14:17,209
kept I get people tell me all those guys

301
00:14:21,490 --> 00:14:19,519
when I talk about mj-12 operation

302
00:14:22,990 --> 00:14:21,500
majestic twelve twelve guys on there

303
00:14:26,319 --> 00:14:23,000
well they were told their wives what

304
00:14:28,150 --> 00:14:26,329
they were doing no they wouldn't I never

305
00:14:29,980 --> 00:14:28,160
told my wife anything classified it

306
00:14:32,410 --> 00:14:29,990
would be utterly stupid I could lose my

307
00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:32,420
job for one thing I can't control what

308
00:14:37,030 --> 00:14:34,970
she says talking to friends and I don't

309
00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:37,040
bits of this and not that somebody else

310
00:14:44,439 --> 00:14:40,490
might pick up on you just don't do that

311
00:14:46,509 --> 00:14:44,449
and it's naive on the part of some

312
00:14:48,790 --> 00:14:46,519
people the academics seem to be

313
00:14:51,310 --> 00:14:48,800
particularly concerned with well

314
00:14:53,519 --> 00:14:51,320
research is what goes on at universities

315
00:14:57,160 --> 00:14:53,529
you know you publish papers in

316
00:14:59,410 --> 00:14:57,170
peer-reviewed journals as an awful lot

317
00:15:01,840 --> 00:14:59,420
of stuff that doesn't get put into peer

318
00:15:07,210 --> 00:15:01,850
reviewed journals I'll guaranteed that

319
00:15:11,050 --> 00:15:07,220
and the thing is that I the big area I'm

320
00:15:13,090 --> 00:15:11,060
concerned with here is technology you

321
00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:13,100
know how do you fly this way or that way

322
00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:16,250
how do you spy this way or that way all

323
00:15:21,220 --> 00:15:19,010
kinds of things and I've had the

324
00:15:22,639 --> 00:15:21,230
privilege of working under security for

325
00:15:25,460 --> 00:15:22,649
14 years

326
00:15:28,100 --> 00:15:25,470
and working on a number of canceled

327
00:15:30,439 --> 00:15:28,110
government-sponsored programs and of

328
00:15:35,179 --> 00:15:30,449
recognizing that there's some some point

329
00:15:37,160 --> 00:15:35,189
to the classification alright and we act

330
00:15:39,379 --> 00:15:37,170
sometimes as if that whole world didn't

331
00:15:41,150 --> 00:15:39,389
exist out there you know look look in

332
00:15:44,629 --> 00:15:41,160
the journals stand I don't tell you what

333
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:44,639
you wanna know as a matter of fact III

334
00:15:48,230 --> 00:15:46,170
had the experience of working on

335
00:15:50,809 --> 00:15:48,240
aircraft new propulsion I was working on

336
00:15:52,369 --> 00:15:50,819
radiation shielding because if you got a

337
00:15:54,439 --> 00:15:52,379
nuclear-powered airplane you really

338
00:15:58,850 --> 00:15:54,449
don't want to cook the pilots you know

339
00:16:00,559 --> 00:15:58,860
not a good idea and so I had the need to

340
00:16:03,499 --> 00:16:00,569
know and I was looked at an abstract

341
00:16:06,439 --> 00:16:03,509
journal classified journal that listed

342
00:16:08,919 --> 00:16:06,449
new documents out each month and all the

343
00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:08,929
Navy was doing some nice shielding work

344
00:16:13,879 --> 00:16:12,240
great so I went to our document control

345
00:16:16,790 --> 00:16:13,889
people I'd like to get copies of these

346
00:16:18,559 --> 00:16:16,800
things they come back to me not too long

347
00:16:20,780 --> 00:16:18,569
I understand you can't you don't have a

348
00:16:23,359 --> 00:16:20,790
need to know yes you've got the right

349
00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:23,369
clearance but you don't have a need to

350
00:16:27,650 --> 00:16:25,410
know and they're not given out and he

351
00:16:31,369 --> 00:16:27,660
needs to know I need to know on those

352
00:16:34,699 --> 00:16:31,379
programs so you learn about these things

353
00:16:37,929 --> 00:16:34,709
and that's the real world and you know

354
00:16:40,369 --> 00:16:37,939
it sounds crazy to some people a

355
00:16:43,850 --> 00:16:40,379
scientist supposed to be open and you

356
00:16:46,249 --> 00:16:43,860
know talking to his peers and like I say

357
00:16:50,689 --> 00:16:46,259
peer-reviewed journals and it just

358
00:16:52,429 --> 00:16:50,699
doesn't work that way and you know

359
00:16:56,210 --> 00:16:52,439
anybody thinks it does is being terribly

360
00:16:59,090 --> 00:16:56,220
naive and so I'm sure we have recovered

361
00:17:03,650 --> 00:16:59,100
crash flying saucers at least at Roswell

362
00:17:05,419 --> 00:17:03,660
and then the plains of San Agustin and a

363
00:17:12,769 --> 00:17:05,429
few other places at Kecksburg

364
00:17:15,079 --> 00:17:12,779
Pennsylvania Aztec New Mexico but I'm

365
00:17:17,269 --> 00:17:15,089
sure almost certain that the Russians

366
00:17:20,659 --> 00:17:17,279
and others have recovered them other

367
00:17:22,090 --> 00:17:20,669
places they're crazy things have

368
00:17:25,429 --> 00:17:22,100
happened to flying vehicles

369
00:17:28,159 --> 00:17:25,439
inadvertently not not many people crash

370
00:17:29,570 --> 00:17:28,169
them intentionally but you know you're

371
00:17:31,850 --> 00:17:29,580
in the wrong place at the wrong time for

372
00:17:35,899 --> 00:17:31,860
something to happen what can I say

373
00:17:36,440 --> 00:17:35,909
so I I'm aware of that that's all that's

374
00:17:38,180 --> 00:17:36,450
interest

375
00:17:39,889 --> 00:17:38,190
did you say that because it seems to me

376
00:17:41,509 --> 00:17:39,899
that you're aware of that on a couple of

377
00:17:44,570 --> 00:17:41,519
different levels you know we did have

378
00:17:46,009 --> 00:17:44,580
this email exchange and I appreciate

379
00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:46,019
some of the things you said you said hey

380
00:17:49,759 --> 00:17:47,970
maybe we could talk about this like all

381
00:17:52,460 --> 00:17:49,769
the Goldilocks planets that are being

382
00:17:54,259 --> 00:17:52,470
discovered and I said hey that sounds to

383
00:17:56,720 --> 00:17:54,269
me like sign of a kind of a controlled

384
00:17:59,779 --> 00:17:56,730
release of information to which you

385
00:18:01,999 --> 00:17:59,789
correctly replied that you weren't

386
00:18:04,669 --> 00:18:02,009
involved in the controlled release of

387
00:18:05,629 --> 00:18:04,679
secret information and that you followed

388
00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:05,639
the rules

389
00:18:13,659 --> 00:18:09,570
in handling of classified information I

390
00:18:16,149 --> 00:18:13,669
totally get that I totally respect that

391
00:18:20,659 --> 00:18:16,159
but there's a whole host of questions

392
00:18:23,389 --> 00:18:20,669
associated with that as you just kind of

393
00:18:27,200 --> 00:18:23,399
talk about and let's go through some of

394
00:18:29,409 --> 00:18:27,210
those because okay first of all you kept

395
00:18:34,519 --> 00:18:29,419
your promise you didn't break the rules

396
00:18:36,499 --> 00:18:34,529
but are we really to believe in this day

397
00:18:38,840 --> 00:18:36,509
and age that that is necessarily

398
00:18:42,560 --> 00:18:38,850
something that everyone should follow

399
00:18:45,379 --> 00:18:42,570
all the time how do you feel about the

400
00:18:47,440 --> 00:18:45,389
government potentially releasing people

401
00:18:50,840 --> 00:18:47,450
from their NDA's from their

402
00:18:52,789 --> 00:18:50,850
non-disclosure agreements when those

403
00:18:56,389 --> 00:18:52,799
disclosure agreements were entered into

404
00:18:59,029 --> 00:18:56,399
under false pretenses or with as part of

405
00:19:02,560 --> 00:18:59,039
a larger misinformation campaign should

406
00:19:05,299 --> 00:19:02,570
people really have to keep their secrets

407
00:19:10,759 --> 00:19:05,309
when they were bound to those those

408
00:19:12,139 --> 00:19:10,769
secrets under kind of false pretenses if

409
00:19:14,210 --> 00:19:12,149
you I don't think there were false

410
00:19:15,950 --> 00:19:14,220
pretenses well sometimes they sometimes

411
00:19:18,049 --> 00:19:15,960
they were maybe not in your case but

412
00:19:19,759 --> 00:19:18,059
sometimes they were and you were hey you

413
00:19:23,019 --> 00:19:19,769
were involved with one in one of the

414
00:19:26,629 --> 00:19:23,029
largest most public disinformation

415
00:19:30,440 --> 00:19:26,639
campaigns probably in UFO history with

416
00:19:34,029 --> 00:19:30,450
the Richard Doty Bill Moore thing so I

417
00:19:36,830 --> 00:19:34,039
mean you got first hand up close and

418
00:19:40,249 --> 00:19:36,840
personal with how these things can

419
00:19:42,979 --> 00:19:40,259
really be would really go wrong didn't

420
00:19:46,669 --> 00:19:42,989
you does that hug well I don't think of

421
00:19:50,210 --> 00:19:46,679
it that way I think Jody was doing his

422
00:19:51,490 --> 00:19:50,220
job and some

423
00:19:56,120 --> 00:19:51,500
you have to put out this information

424
00:19:59,470 --> 00:19:56,130
okay I don't like that but I understand

425
00:20:01,820 --> 00:19:59,480
it as I said the first country to

426
00:20:04,340 --> 00:20:01,830
duplicate flying saucer behavior is

427
00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:04,350
going to rule the roost and it won't be

428
00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:06,330
cheap incidentally to do that that's

429
00:20:11,270 --> 00:20:08,250
well one of the things people understand

430
00:20:15,649 --> 00:20:11,280
is how much it costs to develop entirely

431
00:20:17,360 --> 00:20:15,659
new technology it the future is not an

432
00:20:20,630 --> 00:20:17,370
extrapolation of the past you have to

433
00:20:24,950 --> 00:20:20,640
change how you do things that cost marks

434
00:20:28,490 --> 00:20:24,960
lots of them and so you can't do it

435
00:20:31,490 --> 00:20:28,500
easily if it were easy it would have

436
00:20:34,370 --> 00:20:31,500
been done before you know it's the basic

437
00:20:36,590 --> 00:20:34,380
notion I'm surprised to hear you say

438
00:20:39,140 --> 00:20:36,600
that Dodie was doing his job on one

439
00:20:41,630 --> 00:20:39,150
level I get that on another level it

440
00:20:44,539 --> 00:20:41,640
seems to me that he was stepping outside

441
00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:44,549
the bounds that we normally associate

442
00:20:50,450 --> 00:20:47,970
with constitutional government with

443
00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:50,460
oversight with how the government is

444
00:20:54,470 --> 00:20:52,770
supposed to treat its citizens I mean

445
00:20:57,770 --> 00:20:54,480
him and Bill Moore

446
00:20:59,870 --> 00:20:57,780
you know drove bennewitz crazy by

447
00:21:02,450 --> 00:20:59,880
sneaking into his house and rearranging

448
00:21:04,850 --> 00:21:02,460
his furniture in a direct attempt to

449
00:21:09,919 --> 00:21:04,860
kind of drive a guy insane and they did

450
00:21:13,190 --> 00:21:09,929
it I mean that's not doing your job I'm

451
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:13,200
not saying he didn't go overboard I'm

452
00:21:16,909 --> 00:21:15,210
not saying I'm done the other end that I

453
00:21:19,240 --> 00:21:16,919
don't I don't know if there were any

454
00:21:21,350 --> 00:21:19,250
orders from powers-that-be

455
00:21:22,909 --> 00:21:21,360
things are getting touchy here guys

456
00:21:24,950 --> 00:21:22,919
we've got to do something so it's not

457
00:21:27,159 --> 00:21:24,960
the movement in the direction of people

458
00:21:30,200 --> 00:21:27,169
finding out what we're doing

459
00:21:32,870 --> 00:21:30,210
you know misrepresentation part of the

460
00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:32,880
picture sure the greater good for the

461
00:21:37,310 --> 00:21:35,010
most people all that sort of stuff and I

462
00:21:39,350 --> 00:21:37,320
don't like that notion you know it would

463
00:21:41,289 --> 00:21:39,360
be nice to live in a free and open world

464
00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:41,299
or everybody tells everybody everything

465
00:21:47,899 --> 00:21:43,770
but that's not the world we live in

466
00:21:49,760 --> 00:21:47,909
right and you know we're talking look

467
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:49,770
for the development of Manhattan Project

468
00:21:56,419 --> 00:21:53,640
cost many billions of dollars we built a

469
00:21:58,520 --> 00:21:56,429
facility to separate uranium isotopes I

470
00:22:00,950 --> 00:21:58,530
mean to put uranium normal natural

471
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:00,960
uranium in at this end and get highly

472
00:22:09,110 --> 00:22:04,050
enriched uranium-235 at the other end

473
00:22:11,840 --> 00:22:09,120
that facility was a mile long it used 5%

474
00:22:14,210 --> 00:22:11,850
of all the power being generated in the

475
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:14,220
United States even though this is in the

476
00:22:19,250 --> 00:22:16,650
midst of a war you know so we had to

477
00:22:21,230 --> 00:22:19,260
build guns and planes and tanks and

478
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:21,240
ships and all that kind of stuff

479
00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:23,250
five percent of the power in the United

480
00:22:28,670 --> 00:22:26,250
States went into separating uranium

481
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:28,680
isotopes and nobody knew about it except

482
00:22:35,300 --> 00:22:32,010
the people who were directly involved so

483
00:22:37,010 --> 00:22:35,310
yeah it's a price you pay but you know

484
00:22:39,440 --> 00:22:37,020
people don't realize how close we came

485
00:22:41,330 --> 00:22:39,450
to losing world war two right thank

486
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:41,340
goodness we broke the German codes for

487
00:22:46,790 --> 00:22:43,170
example do you think we we're gonna

488
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:46,800
broadcast Hey look what we did the the

489
00:22:51,230 --> 00:22:49,290
fact that we had broken the codes enigma

490
00:22:53,690 --> 00:22:51,240
and all that stuff wasn't revealed for

491
00:22:57,950 --> 00:22:53,700
25 years because other countries are

492
00:22:59,840 --> 00:22:57,960
using those codes too so we were

493
00:23:04,730 --> 00:22:59,850
listening to their conversations if you

494
00:23:07,970 --> 00:23:04,740
will so there's a lot going on and it's

495
00:23:09,710 --> 00:23:07,980
kind of it's distressing that we live on

496
00:23:11,510 --> 00:23:09,720
a planet like that it does only tell

497
00:23:14,690 --> 00:23:11,520
people we're a primitive society whose

498
00:23:17,450 --> 00:23:14,700
major activity is tribal warfare I'm not

499
00:23:19,580 --> 00:23:17,460
proud when I say that there must be a

500
00:23:22,910 --> 00:23:19,590
better way to run a planet hopefully

501
00:23:25,010 --> 00:23:22,920
some of the aliens know that you know it

502
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:25,020
would be nice to think that we're

503
00:23:30,170 --> 00:23:26,970
johnny-come-lately we don't ever act

504
00:23:32,240 --> 00:23:30,180
together yet you know but sometime our

505
00:23:33,770 --> 00:23:32,250
my great-grand I have a great grandson I

506
00:23:40,180 --> 00:23:33,780
wonder what kind of world he's going to

507
00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:40,190
grow up in you know I it scares me and

508
00:23:45,590 --> 00:23:43,530
they give you an example the the crucial

509
00:23:48,020 --> 00:23:45,600
form of energy production in the

510
00:23:50,690 --> 00:23:48,030
universe is nuclear fusion that's what

511
00:23:52,870 --> 00:23:50,700
goes on in all the stars every single

512
00:23:55,340 --> 00:23:52,880
one of them some big some small some

513
00:24:00,230 --> 00:23:55,350
powerful some not so powerful if you

514
00:24:02,930 --> 00:24:00,240
will and people say okay you're talking

515
00:24:04,850 --> 00:24:02,940
about weapons I say no anybody's got any

516
00:24:06,830 --> 00:24:04,860
brains knows that if you're setting off

517
00:24:10,550 --> 00:24:06,840
nuclear weapons you also know how to

518
00:24:11,330 --> 00:24:10,560
travel to the stars right well that's

519
00:24:13,430 --> 00:24:11,340
true

520
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:13,440
I worked on a study at fusion propulsion

521
00:24:20,550 --> 00:24:16,930
for deep space travel in 1960

522
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:20,560
to like makes me feel ancient to tell

523
00:24:26,700 --> 00:24:24,250
you that and the conclusion was if you

524
00:24:31,170 --> 00:24:26,710
want to go all it takes is dough

525
00:24:32,730 --> 00:24:31,180
lots of dough lots and lots of dough but

526
00:24:34,770 --> 00:24:32,740
I mean that's what the planet this year

527
00:24:37,050 --> 00:24:34,780
military budget trillion dollars

528
00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:37,060
I'll trillion dollars that's that's on

529
00:24:41,850 --> 00:24:39,850
on the outside right I mean we suspect

530
00:24:43,500 --> 00:24:41,860
we know by government accounting that

531
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:43,510
there's at this point something like

532
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:46,690
twenty trillion that is lost right so

533
00:24:52,410 --> 00:24:50,530
well we don't know we think and there

534
00:24:54,090 --> 00:24:52,420
are people who make claims a lot of

535
00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:54,100
claims going on without being

536
00:24:58,890 --> 00:24:56,170
established this true I don't know

537
00:25:01,380 --> 00:24:58,900
Catherine offs Catherine Austin Fitz has

538
00:25:04,350 --> 00:25:01,390
the math done pretty well at about

539
00:25:07,410 --> 00:25:04,360
sixteen trillion I mean we remember a

540
00:25:10,140 --> 00:25:07,420
few years ago the day before 9/11 when

541
00:25:12,990 --> 00:25:10,150
it was announced that we lost three

542
00:25:14,820 --> 00:25:13,000
trillion that the the State Department

543
00:25:16,980 --> 00:25:14,830
can account for treat three trillion I

544
00:25:19,320 --> 00:25:16,990
trust the numbers that it's up to

545
00:25:21,780 --> 00:25:19,330
sixteen trillion I'm not saying I'm with

546
00:25:24,810 --> 00:25:21,790
you to a large extent and I think your

547
00:25:26,820 --> 00:25:24,820
point is is very sobering and realistic

548
00:25:28,830 --> 00:25:26,830
that this stuff goes on we can't look

549
00:25:32,060 --> 00:25:28,840
the other way but I'm just saying the

550
00:25:35,840 --> 00:25:32,070
the off-the-books amount is probably a

551
00:25:38,790 --> 00:25:35,850
factor of ten of that one one trillion

552
00:25:41,550 --> 00:25:38,800
well I'll say maybe it's in my grave a

553
00:25:43,830 --> 00:25:41,560
second I'm like not why maybe because

554
00:25:46,890 --> 00:25:43,840
when you don't know you don't know and

555
00:25:50,130 --> 00:25:46,900
guessing is fine you know if you're

556
00:25:52,470 --> 00:25:50,140
playing the horses I guess sometimes

557
00:25:55,460 --> 00:25:52,480
even when I know people I just register

558
00:25:58,140 --> 00:25:55,470
in the paper somebody won the lottery

559
00:26:06,720 --> 00:25:58,150
special lottery only half million

560
00:26:09,720 --> 00:26:06,730
dollars in cash but the unlikely and

561
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:09,730
unusual does happen from time to time

562
00:26:16,500 --> 00:26:13,210
and it's sort of unpredictable but I

563
00:26:19,410 --> 00:26:16,510
think the thing about UFOs and aliens is

564
00:26:20,970 --> 00:26:19,420
we have to change our attitude about a

565
00:26:22,770 --> 00:26:20,980
couple of things it wasn't too many

566
00:26:25,710 --> 00:26:22,780
years ago that we thought gee this is

567
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:25,720
the only solar system and Earth's the

568
00:26:30,570 --> 00:26:27,730
only one that's got water on the surface

569
00:26:34,800 --> 00:26:30,580
and oxygen in the air why we're special

570
00:26:37,290 --> 00:26:34,810
guys and now I hate to say this but

571
00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:37,300
we're not special at all the Kepler

572
00:26:44,700 --> 00:26:39,930
space satellite which I'm a great fan of

573
00:26:47,910 --> 00:26:44,710
in an incredibly sensitive to pick up

574
00:26:49,500 --> 00:26:47,920
planets going in front of us star you

575
00:26:53,330 --> 00:26:49,510
know it's like seeing a butterfly go in

576
00:26:59,820 --> 00:26:53,340
front of a traffic light two miles away

577
00:27:02,610 --> 00:26:59,830
reduce the light from it it's we now

578
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:02,620
think that there are between one and one

579
00:27:07,920 --> 00:27:06,490
point six planets per star so what does

580
00:27:11,210 --> 00:27:07,930
that mean well within a hundred

581
00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:11,220
light-years of here just down the street

582
00:27:18,270 --> 00:27:16,330
there are ten thousand stars that means

583
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:18,280
between ten thousand and sixteen

584
00:27:22,620 --> 00:27:20,650
thousand planets within a mere hundred

585
00:27:24,540 --> 00:27:22,630
light-years of here

586
00:27:28,410 --> 00:27:24,550
when you say glad planets you mean

587
00:27:31,770 --> 00:27:28,420
planets that are most likely no I mean

588
00:27:34,170 --> 00:27:31,780
finite period all kinds big ones small

589
00:27:36,060 --> 00:27:34,180
ones fat ones smaller thin ones one

590
00:27:42,870 --> 00:27:36,070
planet you're saying one point six

591
00:27:44,820 --> 00:27:42,880
planets per star yeah that was a lot

592
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:44,830
more than that I think we're talking

593
00:27:51,390 --> 00:27:49,330
about there Stan I look this up because

594
00:27:55,020 --> 00:27:51,400
I was curious effect what's the latest

595
00:27:57,810 --> 00:27:55,030
scoop and remember captor only looks at

596
00:27:59,610 --> 00:27:57,820
a certain chunk of the sky you don't

597
00:28:03,030 --> 00:27:59,620
deer have it look at the Sun because

598
00:28:07,470 --> 00:28:03,040
rice dollars or electronics optics out

599
00:28:09,420 --> 00:28:07,480
of it but uh but even that's I'm not

600
00:28:11,850 --> 00:28:09,430
saying all those planets

601
00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:11,860
between ten thousand sixteen thousand

602
00:28:15,690 --> 00:28:14,050
within a hundred light years I'm not

603
00:28:19,170 --> 00:28:15,700
saying they all have life maybe it's

604
00:28:22,500 --> 00:28:19,180
only ten percent I got a lot when you

605
00:28:23,220 --> 00:28:22,510
stop to think about it and also the time

606
00:28:25,500 --> 00:28:23,230
factor

607
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:25,510
I mean Gerald Bishop Ussher back in the

608
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:31,210
1600s he was kept on sex if you will he

609
00:28:33,510 --> 00:28:32,890
was looking through the Bible at all the

610
00:28:36,090 --> 00:28:33,520
begats

611
00:28:39,180 --> 00:28:36,100
and he worked it out so that the world

612
00:28:40,830 --> 00:28:39,190
must have been created in 4004 BC I

613
00:28:44,719 --> 00:28:40,840
don't know whether he said it was a

614
00:28:52,529 --> 00:28:48,119
4004 BC now we know that the earth is at

615
00:28:53,999 --> 00:28:52,539
least 4 billion and 4 years old 4

616
00:28:59,159 --> 00:28:54,009
billion there's a big difference between

617
00:29:02,249 --> 00:28:59,169
4 billion and 4th us obviously so what

618
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:02,259
I'm saying is there's plenty of time for

619
00:29:07,070 --> 00:29:04,570
there to have been planets come and go

620
00:29:09,629 --> 00:29:07,080
and civilizations come and go and you

621
00:29:11,779 --> 00:29:09,639
know maybe we're in a no-man's land

622
00:29:14,190 --> 00:29:11,789
where it's forbidden there's a sign up

623
00:29:19,469 --> 00:29:14,200
stay away from Earth a bunch of idiots

624
00:29:22,499 --> 00:29:19,479
there right and the kicker is we have to

625
00:29:25,769 --> 00:29:22,509
recognize that there's somebody out

626
00:29:28,259 --> 00:29:25,779
there and if you look at say the case of

627
00:29:31,859 --> 00:29:28,269
the Minuteman facility and mounts from

628
00:29:35,070 --> 00:29:31,869
Air Force Base sascha shows up a bunch

629
00:29:39,239 --> 00:29:35,080
of rockets underground ICBMs loaded with

630
00:29:41,359 --> 00:29:39,249
nuclear weapons and this UFO shows up at

631
00:29:45,209 --> 00:29:41,369
the gate and the guy calls down to the

632
00:29:48,180 --> 00:29:45,219
guy in charge underground and he thought

633
00:29:48,989 --> 00:29:48,190
he was joking frankly and I'll don't

634
00:29:50,639 --> 00:29:48,999
worry about it

635
00:29:54,479 --> 00:29:50,649
he calls him back in a few minutes

636
00:29:55,919 --> 00:29:54,489
obviously greatly distressed and you

637
00:29:59,219 --> 00:29:55,929
know this thing is really here and

638
00:30:02,249 --> 00:29:59,229
within the next couple minutes 10 ICBMs

639
00:30:05,369 --> 00:30:02,259
went off line one after the other now

640
00:30:08,989 --> 00:30:05,379
theoretically that can happen that's

641
00:30:13,229 --> 00:30:08,999
designed to be independent of course and

642
00:30:14,820 --> 00:30:13,239
but it did happen so and some of the

643
00:30:18,499 --> 00:30:14,830
things happen in the Soviet Union one of

644
00:30:21,659 --> 00:30:18,509
their events we've heard about is that

645
00:30:28,079 --> 00:30:21,669
the missiles went online which is even

646
00:30:31,799 --> 00:30:28,089
scarier so in this world in which we

647
00:30:35,669 --> 00:30:31,809
lived there are prospects for terrible

648
00:30:38,039 --> 00:30:35,679
things happening and you know I hear

649
00:30:39,959 --> 00:30:38,049
people the SETI community I call them

650
00:30:42,659 --> 00:30:39,969
silly effort to investigate you know

651
00:30:44,129 --> 00:30:42,669
SETI not search for extraterrestrial

652
00:30:46,409 --> 00:30:44,139
intelligence because they're ignoring

653
00:30:48,269 --> 00:30:46,419
all the UFO data you look at their books

654
00:30:50,849 --> 00:30:48,279
I don't even reference a good books on

655
00:30:55,349 --> 00:30:50,859
UFOs I reference their books even if

656
00:30:57,480 --> 00:30:55,359
they're not good but there is a lot of

657
00:31:00,180 --> 00:30:57,490
data out there and they refuse to see it

658
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:00,190
because obvious you know I'm well

659
00:31:10,620 --> 00:31:06,730
obviously if you don't if you're here if

660
00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:10,630
they're out there and coming here it

661
00:31:15,779 --> 00:31:13,210
could be of concern to us how could we

662
00:31:18,090 --> 00:31:15,789
ignore that we don't know if they're

663
00:31:19,649 --> 00:31:18,100
good guys are bad guys all this gets

664
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:19,659
back to your topic we were talking about

665
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:22,210
just a few minutes ago and that has to

666
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:25,090
do with disclosure in a way it traces

667
00:31:29,340 --> 00:31:27,730
back to that because and and I think you

668
00:31:31,710 --> 00:31:29,350
have an interesting perspective on this

669
00:31:32,970 --> 00:31:31,720
that I haven't heard expressed a lot of

670
00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:32,980
times and I'd like to talk to you about

671
00:31:40,200 --> 00:31:36,610
it because you lived through several of

672
00:31:42,360 --> 00:31:40,210
these waves of disclosure you know you

673
00:31:46,260 --> 00:31:42,370
mentioned the majestic 12 mj-12

674
00:31:49,289 --> 00:31:46,270
documents that was we all thought that

675
00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:49,299
was going to be one of the the biggest

676
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:51,730
cases or the most clear-cut cases of

677
00:31:57,090 --> 00:31:54,610
disclosure it's all out there now we

678
00:32:00,389 --> 00:31:57,100
know blow the lid off it change the

679
00:32:03,570 --> 00:32:00,399
world kind of a disclosure and whether

680
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:03,580
you say it was a misinformation plot and

681
00:32:07,799 --> 00:32:06,130
a disinformation plot it whether it was

682
00:32:10,710 --> 00:32:07,809
I think as you said a few minutes ago

683
00:32:14,580 --> 00:32:10,720
someone deciding hey we need to refocus

684
00:32:16,019 --> 00:32:14,590
this redirect this it certainly worked

685
00:32:19,470 --> 00:32:16,029
turned out that way

686
00:32:23,760 --> 00:32:19,480
and I wonder what perspective that gives

687
00:32:25,830 --> 00:32:23,770
you on this new round of disclosure that

688
00:32:28,649 --> 00:32:25,840
we seem to be heading into where it's

689
00:32:31,710 --> 00:32:28,659
it's coming guys it's right around the

690
00:32:34,200 --> 00:32:31,720
corner here it comes get ready for it

691
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:34,210
you're gonna learn all the secrets kind

692
00:32:40,529 --> 00:32:35,890
of thing I mean haven't you seen my

693
00:32:42,779 --> 00:32:40,539
story before well I look one of the

694
00:32:44,519 --> 00:32:42,789
things that's intriguing about mj-12 is

695
00:32:48,720 --> 00:32:44,529
how many phony documents were put out

696
00:32:51,060 --> 00:32:48,730
after the stuff hit the fan awesome all

697
00:32:52,409 --> 00:32:51,070
right completely and so that leaves many

698
00:32:54,419 --> 00:32:52,419
people able to say well see these

699
00:32:56,130 --> 00:32:54,429
documents are phony so ignore them I'm

700
00:32:57,149 --> 00:32:56,140
saying there are three that are genuine

701
00:32:59,430 --> 00:32:57,159
they're the ones that matter I don't

702
00:33:01,490 --> 00:32:59,440
care about the phony ones its standard

703
00:33:05,039 --> 00:33:01,500
practice to put out this information

704
00:33:06,750 --> 00:33:05,049
standard practice by who for what reason

705
00:33:09,810 --> 00:33:06,760
and why would that I mean so forget

706
00:33:11,030 --> 00:33:09,820
mj-12 set it aside for a minute that all

707
00:33:13,370 --> 00:33:11,040
the confusion

708
00:33:16,490 --> 00:33:13,380
about that part standard practice for

709
00:33:19,430 --> 00:33:16,500
who for what reason and what does that

710
00:33:23,330 --> 00:33:19,440
say about how we should feel about the

711
00:33:25,580 --> 00:33:23,340
current round of disclosure well I see

712
00:33:27,500 --> 00:33:25,590
no reason to say that there really is a

713
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:27,510
current amount of disclosure it's just a

714
00:33:29,630 --> 00:33:29,130
bunch of guys claiming that it's going

715
00:33:32,810 --> 00:33:29,640
to happen

716
00:33:35,210 --> 00:33:32,820
aye aye aye I think that we need to

717
00:33:39,050 --> 00:33:35,220
recognize that there are good reasons

718
00:33:42,500 --> 00:33:39,060
for keeping secrets and you don't want

719
00:33:45,020 --> 00:33:42,510
your enemies to know what you know about

720
00:33:48,140 --> 00:33:45,030
what you know or about what you know

721
00:33:49,790 --> 00:33:48,150
they know because the weapon encounter

722
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:49,800
weapon encounter counter weapons these

723
00:33:56,060 --> 00:33:51,210
have been games of them playing for a

724
00:33:58,270 --> 00:33:56,070
long time so I think that it would be

725
00:34:01,370 --> 00:33:58,280
standard practice if something slips out

726
00:34:03,950 --> 00:34:01,380
do whatever you can to cover it up you

727
00:34:08,210 --> 00:34:03,960
can't just stand up and say that you put

728
00:34:11,240 --> 00:34:08,220
out crap mj-12 and that's why I use that

729
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:11,250
because as I have a book out top secret

730
00:34:17,210 --> 00:34:14,970
magic I'm AJ I see which it goes into a

731
00:34:20,659 --> 00:34:17,220
number of the documents and why I say

732
00:34:25,490 --> 00:34:20,669
they're phony and it's clear they're

733
00:34:28,340 --> 00:34:25,500
phony if you look carefully and it's

734
00:34:32,440 --> 00:34:28,350
it's kind of funny how the debunkers

735
00:34:35,090 --> 00:34:32,450
glom on to disclosure in their own way

736
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:35,100
Philip Glass challenged me on one of the

737
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:38,850
mj-12 documents the color declining memo

738
00:34:44,360 --> 00:34:41,970
to being precise well obviously it's a

739
00:34:46,970 --> 00:34:44,370
phony document because it's done in the

740
00:34:50,630 --> 00:34:46,980
large Piko type and the national

741
00:34:53,090 --> 00:34:50,640
security national security council used

742
00:34:55,520 --> 00:34:53,100
only small elite tonight but I've got

743
00:34:58,100 --> 00:34:55,530
nine documents to prove it and he

744
00:35:00,410 --> 00:34:58,110
offered me $100 each I'll give you for

745
00:35:08,210 --> 00:35:00,420
every genuine document meeting a whole

746
00:35:11,810 --> 00:35:08,220
bunch of rules if you will you have 60

747
00:35:13,870 --> 00:35:11,820
days anybody's had a limit only on ten

748
00:35:17,750 --> 00:35:13,880
unfortunately I'd be a wealthy man

749
00:35:21,170 --> 00:35:17,760
anyway I found out I mean I went to my

750
00:35:22,490 --> 00:35:21,180
files and I spent a lot of time at the

751
00:35:23,420 --> 00:35:22,500
Eisenhower library the Truman library

752
00:35:26,329 --> 00:35:23,430
can

753
00:35:28,670 --> 00:35:26,339
librarian Center and immediately found

754
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:28,680
20 documents that were done in a larger

755
00:35:32,450 --> 00:35:30,930
Piko type it's hard to it's easy to see

756
00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:32,460
actually when you look at them alongside

757
00:35:36,410 --> 00:35:33,930
other ones huh

758
00:35:38,240 --> 00:35:36,420
so I knew that was a bunch of baloney

759
00:35:41,809 --> 00:35:38,250
but I was going to the Eisenhower

760
00:35:45,440 --> 00:35:41,819
library so anyway and soon and so I went

761
00:35:49,099 --> 00:35:45,450
found 14 that met every single condition

762
00:35:50,569 --> 00:35:49,109
he put on them and sent him copies and

763
00:35:52,970 --> 00:35:50,579
an invoice for a thousand dollars

764
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:52,980
because he said a limit of ten and he

765
00:36:00,890 --> 00:35:56,970
paid me and he got mattered and when I

766
00:36:02,780 --> 00:36:00,900
published a copy of his check and I

767
00:36:05,059 --> 00:36:02,790
finally told him I said look Phil you

768
00:36:08,030 --> 00:36:05,069
sent me a check izx the check

769
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:08,040
I took the check to the bank the bank

770
00:36:14,780 --> 00:36:10,290
cashed it I can do whatever I damn

771
00:36:16,700 --> 00:36:14,790
please with Xerox and so he shut up but

772
00:36:20,540 --> 00:36:16,710
it turns out and I didn't know it until

773
00:36:21,890 --> 00:36:20,550
then I come and I own a check and it

774
00:36:23,630 --> 00:36:21,900
turns out he'd never been to the

775
00:36:25,910 --> 00:36:23,640
Eisenhower library I've spent weeks

776
00:36:27,349 --> 00:36:25,920
there but that's typical of the

777
00:36:30,650 --> 00:36:27,359
intellectual bankruptcy of the

778
00:36:33,470 --> 00:36:30,660
pseudoscience of anti ufology and the

779
00:36:35,120 --> 00:36:33,480
question is who's he working for and he

780
00:36:37,250 --> 00:36:35,130
claims he didn't work for any

781
00:36:41,450 --> 00:36:37,260
three-letter agency well how about a for

782
00:36:44,559 --> 00:36:41,460
later yeah you know what for a letter

783
00:36:46,730 --> 00:36:44,569
one I can't even think of one

784
00:36:48,740 --> 00:36:46,740
psychological strategy board no that's

785
00:36:51,319 --> 00:36:48,750
three I I had a list one time I might

786
00:36:54,049 --> 00:36:51,329
have several of them but the point is

787
00:36:56,539 --> 00:36:54,059
that Phil made claims without anything

788
00:37:00,950 --> 00:36:56,549
to back the month and thought he would

789
00:37:03,500 --> 00:37:00,960
get away with it well he didn't but it

790
00:37:05,210 --> 00:37:03,510
is typical see but there's so many

791
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:05,220
layers to this there's so many layers to

792
00:37:10,430 --> 00:37:07,170
this I don't want to get I mean that's

793
00:37:14,359 --> 00:37:10,440
an important point regarding debunkers

794
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:14,369
regarding skeptics regarding but I don't

795
00:37:19,549 --> 00:37:16,770
want to slam somebody I don't know

796
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:19,559
personally but the useful idiot versus

797
00:37:24,319 --> 00:37:22,170
the lifetime player so there's some

798
00:37:27,740 --> 00:37:24,329
people that are in this mix that are

799
00:37:29,660 --> 00:37:27,750
there to specifically serve a purpose so

800
00:37:32,900 --> 00:37:29,670
Dodi is there and Dodi comes out and

801
00:37:36,450 --> 00:37:32,910
says hey I do this stuff they ain't they

802
00:37:40,770 --> 00:37:36,460
pay me to go and do some very

803
00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:40,780
thirdly kind of stuff that is anti what

804
00:37:46,410 --> 00:37:42,970
our Constitution says we're supposed to

805
00:37:49,170 --> 00:37:46,420
do but wink nod we all know goes on and

806
00:37:51,660 --> 00:37:49,180
all we all accept as part of the way we

807
00:37:54,720 --> 00:37:51,670
keep the Hong's from marching over the

808
00:37:56,070 --> 00:37:54,730
hill kind of thing so that's given but

809
00:37:58,620 --> 00:37:56,080
then there's a whole other group of

810
00:38:00,990 --> 00:37:58,630
people and this is more to my experience

811
00:38:03,780 --> 00:38:01,000
with skeptic oh and in particular with

812
00:38:05,430 --> 00:38:03,790
science and materialistic scientists who

813
00:38:07,320 --> 00:38:05,440
you know just want a hold of their

814
00:38:09,180 --> 00:38:07,330
paradigm there's a lot of useful idiots

815
00:38:11,220 --> 00:38:09,190
out there of course the phrase that

816
00:38:14,339 --> 00:38:11,230
everyone borrows from Joe Stalin who

817
00:38:16,859 --> 00:38:14,349
talked about the American communists who

818
00:38:18,510 --> 00:38:16,869
were just up in arms and been doing his

819
00:38:20,430 --> 00:38:18,520
bidding without him doing anything is

820
00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:20,440
that a man that's great they're working

821
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:23,050
on my behalf without me even having to

822
00:38:27,540 --> 00:38:25,690
do so so that's part of the landscape

823
00:38:29,670 --> 00:38:27,550
and I get that and I'm glad I'm fill in

824
00:38:32,220 --> 00:38:29,680
that history but a more interesting part

825
00:38:35,700 --> 00:38:32,230
to me that I keep coming back to is as

826
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:35,710
you alluded to you know who's deciding

827
00:38:42,660 --> 00:38:39,010
that among the handful of legitimate

828
00:38:45,150 --> 00:38:42,670
mj-12 documents that are in existence we

829
00:38:48,810 --> 00:38:45,160
should package those with hundreds of

830
00:38:52,829 --> 00:38:48,820
other documents to create this elaborate

831
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:52,839
smokescreen and then I'll let you answer

832
00:38:56,910 --> 00:38:54,490
that and then I want to bring that to

833
00:38:58,650 --> 00:38:56,920
the current round because I do think

834
00:39:00,960 --> 00:38:58,660
that is happening again and I'd love to

835
00:39:05,670 --> 00:39:00,970
hear your perspective on it but first

836
00:39:09,300 --> 00:39:05,680
maybe that question well in my latest

837
00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:09,310
book a year old now I is fact fiction

838
00:39:13,070 --> 00:39:11,290
and flying saucers and we focus on three

839
00:39:15,540 --> 00:39:13,080
people fill classes one of them

840
00:39:18,240 --> 00:39:15,550
debunkers disinformation specialist

841
00:39:21,089 --> 00:39:18,250
whatever you want to call them and one

842
00:39:23,220 --> 00:39:21,099
of them was dr. Donald Howard mental a

843
00:39:25,109 --> 00:39:23,230
Harvard University professor of

844
00:39:26,520 --> 00:39:25,119
astronomy and as matter of fact for a

845
00:39:29,339 --> 00:39:26,530
number of years the chairman of the

846
00:39:32,210 --> 00:39:29,349
department that's pretty high up on the

847
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:32,220
pecking order when it comes to you know

848
00:39:39,060 --> 00:39:35,530
important scientific people and I

849
00:39:40,650 --> 00:39:39,070
discovered because I took the trouble to

850
00:39:43,770 --> 00:39:40,660
get permission from trader from people

851
00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:43,780
look at his papers at Harvard and his

852
00:39:49,380 --> 00:39:46,650
name was on a list of people and I

853
00:39:50,099 --> 00:39:49,390
didn't know what to make of it so I got

854
00:39:52,229 --> 00:39:50,109
from Richmond trader

855
00:39:56,430 --> 00:39:52,239
people he was dead to look at his papers

856
00:39:58,499 --> 00:39:56,440
and discovered to my total shock that he

857
00:40:01,170 --> 00:39:58,509
wrote Jack Kennedy they knew each other

858
00:40:03,329 --> 00:40:01,180
they even had breakfast together on

859
00:40:07,559 --> 00:40:03,339
occasion in a Boston area

860
00:40:09,089 --> 00:40:07,569
Kennedy was from Boston area after jack

861
00:40:11,099 --> 00:40:09,099
was elected president

862
00:40:13,430 --> 00:40:11,109
Menzel told them there's one area where

863
00:40:16,470 --> 00:40:13,440
I may be able to be of assistance to you

864
00:40:19,710 --> 00:40:16,480
I've got a longer continuous association

865
00:40:21,930 --> 00:40:19,720
with the National Security Agency NSA no

866
00:40:26,249 --> 00:40:21,940
such any agency you know never says

867
00:40:28,769 --> 00:40:26,259
anything that's nice and when we are

868
00:40:31,859 --> 00:40:28,779
properly cleared to each other this he

869
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:31,869
tells the president mind you I can tell

870
00:40:41,999 --> 00:40:37,210
you more and so I did a lot of follow-up

871
00:40:44,069 --> 00:40:42,009
on that and the failure of the media for

872
00:40:45,390 --> 00:40:44,079
example there were there was a huge

873
00:40:47,819 --> 00:40:45,400
hearing and they were trying to take

874
00:40:50,579 --> 00:40:47,829
away Mendel's clearance

875
00:40:52,950 --> 00:40:50,589
I saw comment from his lawyer to dr.

876
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:52,960
anavar Bush the important scientists in

877
00:41:00,210 --> 00:40:56,650
the country and it was kind of kind of

878
00:41:01,799 --> 00:41:00,220
weird that why are they trying to take

879
00:41:04,140 --> 00:41:01,809
away Menzel's clearance why does he have

880
00:41:06,329 --> 00:41:04,150
a clearance in the first place well when

881
00:41:07,589 --> 00:41:06,339
the surprising thing works was and I

882
00:41:08,759 --> 00:41:07,599
don't know how they managed it there was

883
00:41:11,489 --> 00:41:08,769
nothing New York Times or Washington

884
00:41:13,410 --> 00:41:11,499
Post about that this goes back to like

885
00:41:15,180 --> 00:41:13,420
1950 you know there was a communist

886
00:41:21,210 --> 00:41:15,190
under every bed and - under the twin

887
00:41:25,190 --> 00:41:21,220
beds you know it's crazy so turns out

888
00:41:27,660 --> 00:41:25,200
Mendel was a world-class cryptologist

889
00:41:30,509 --> 00:41:27,670
that's what the NSA is all about of

890
00:41:32,420 --> 00:41:30,519
course but and there's even a paper in a

891
00:41:35,519 --> 00:41:32,430
scientific journal the Cryptologic

892
00:41:37,259 --> 00:41:35,529
contributions of Donald Menzel and he

893
00:41:39,299 --> 00:41:37,269
did classify work for all kinds of

894
00:41:41,609 --> 00:41:39,309
people nobody knew that I'll guarantee

895
00:41:43,289 --> 00:41:41,619
you that people were telling me Stan he

896
00:41:45,749 --> 00:41:43,299
couldn't be he was a debugger

897
00:41:51,140 --> 00:41:45,759
well I'm sorry here's what the evidence

898
00:41:53,420 --> 00:41:51,150
shows so who was he

899
00:41:57,269 --> 00:41:53,430
we know he was working for the NSA

900
00:42:00,870 --> 00:41:57,279
mm-hmm about 30 years worth of you know

901
00:42:03,220 --> 00:42:00,880
and I and and the end of our Bush filled

902
00:42:07,330 --> 00:42:03,230
that detail in Vannevar Bush's long

903
00:42:10,030 --> 00:42:07,340
connected with the early on UFO secrecy

904
00:42:11,800 --> 00:42:10,040
and her other we have all these memos

905
00:42:15,790 --> 00:42:11,810
that say he was like one of the main

906
00:42:17,500 --> 00:42:15,800
guys so well is there any thing to him

907
00:42:21,010 --> 00:42:17,510
standing in the way of this guy's

908
00:42:23,349 --> 00:42:21,020
clearance it supposedly or or we can

909
00:42:25,090 --> 00:42:23,359
deduce from what you're saying that that

910
00:42:26,770 --> 00:42:25,100
clearance would somehow be used to share

911
00:42:28,630 --> 00:42:26,780
some information with the President of

912
00:42:33,609 --> 00:42:28,640
the United States I mean what's going on

913
00:42:35,500 --> 00:42:33,619
there well I think Bush knew what was

914
00:42:39,570 --> 00:42:35,510
going on no question if there was one

915
00:42:42,490 --> 00:42:39,580
scientist who was at the top of the heap

916
00:42:45,730 --> 00:42:42,500
he was involved during the war and

917
00:42:49,780 --> 00:42:45,740
developing all kinds of new technology

918
00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:49,790
new stuff classified stuff and that's

919
00:42:55,270 --> 00:42:52,010
what he was about

920
00:42:58,150 --> 00:42:55,280
and I I was as I say shocked to find out

921
00:43:00,040 --> 00:42:58,160
I was a surprised that Bush was involved

922
00:43:04,780 --> 00:43:00,050
I was very shocked to find out that

923
00:43:06,490 --> 00:43:04,790
mentor wasn't and I developed a healthy

924
00:43:08,230 --> 00:43:06,500
respect for men so because he was

925
00:43:11,290 --> 00:43:08,240
working for his countries well

926
00:43:12,210 --> 00:43:11,300
well-being if you will in what he was

927
00:43:14,050 --> 00:43:12,220
doing

928
00:43:17,380 --> 00:43:14,060
contributing his knowledge and

929
00:43:19,330 --> 00:43:17,390
capabilities to in keeping us a free and

930
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:19,340
open society and like I say a lot of

931
00:43:24,370 --> 00:43:21,410
people won't realize there were some

932
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:24,380
moments during World War Two and we

933
00:43:30,340 --> 00:43:26,330
weren't so sure we'd be winning

934
00:43:31,900 --> 00:43:30,350
thank goodness for secrecy for example

935
00:43:33,730 --> 00:43:31,910
one of the concerns was if the Japanese

936
00:43:36,310 --> 00:43:33,740
found out about we're gonna drop an

937
00:43:38,260 --> 00:43:36,320
atomic bomb on him they'd move American

938
00:43:44,460 --> 00:43:38,270
prisoners of war into that city wouldn't

939
00:43:47,620 --> 00:43:44,470
they go ahead you know so there were

940
00:43:52,540 --> 00:43:47,630
games being played but they're deadly

941
00:43:54,190 --> 00:43:52,550
games all right and I I developed as I

942
00:43:56,770 --> 00:43:54,200
say a healthy respect for men's will

943
00:43:58,599 --> 00:43:56,780
after realizing that he missed working

944
00:44:00,370 --> 00:43:58,609
his butt off for the government then

945
00:44:02,290 --> 00:44:00,380
let's fast forward a little bit and take

946
00:44:04,810 --> 00:44:02,300
that perspective bring that perspective

947
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:04,820
with you and let's talk about some of

948
00:44:09,180 --> 00:44:06,410
the figures that are on the scene now

949
00:44:11,140 --> 00:44:09,190
because this is really going to be

950
00:44:12,849 --> 00:44:11,150
fascinating because again you've lived

951
00:44:14,260 --> 00:44:12,859
through this history you're right in the

952
00:44:15,540 --> 00:44:14,270
middle of it I mean if you weren't like

953
00:44:18,060 --> 00:44:15,550
reporting on it you were

954
00:44:20,250 --> 00:44:18,070
in it what do you make of Steven Greer

955
00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:20,260
what do you make a Steven Greer he's got

956
00:44:24,450 --> 00:44:22,810
a new movie unacknowledged what did you

957
00:44:28,790 --> 00:44:24,460
think of the movie and were you

958
00:44:31,650 --> 00:44:28,800
surprised to see Richard Doty show up

959
00:44:34,410 --> 00:44:31,660
again a confirmed disinformation agent

960
00:44:36,450 --> 00:44:34,420
he shows up in the film there's no

961
00:44:39,450 --> 00:44:36,460
explanation that he has that background

962
00:44:41,820 --> 00:44:39,460
there's no consideration of it he's just

963
00:44:43,680 --> 00:44:41,830
hey here's an insider in the government

964
00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:43,690
so all three of those what do you make a

965
00:44:48,150 --> 00:44:45,850
Greer what do you make of the movie what

966
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:48,160
do you make of a disinformation agent I

967
00:44:53,580 --> 00:44:50,650
saw the movie at a conference and I was

968
00:44:55,230 --> 00:44:53,590
not favorably impressed and my feeling

969
00:44:58,200 --> 00:44:55,240
has always been I've heard Steve speak

970
00:45:02,010 --> 00:44:58,210
many times that he really doesn't

971
00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:02,020
understand security that and I I'm

972
00:45:05,610 --> 00:45:04,210
bothered by things like he was offering

973
00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:05,620
people the opportunity they could spend

974
00:45:10,500 --> 00:45:07,690
a weekend at his farm in Virginia of

975
00:45:12,900 --> 00:45:10,510
course are some dollars there all

976
00:45:15,780 --> 00:45:12,910
expenses covered but they would have to

977
00:45:17,940 --> 00:45:15,790
sign a nondisclosure agreement he would

978
00:45:19,020 --> 00:45:17,950
tell him everything he knew this is from

979
00:45:23,220 --> 00:45:19,030
the guy who's in charge of the

980
00:45:24,570 --> 00:45:23,230
disclosure movement I mean that's pretty

981
00:45:28,410 --> 00:45:24,580
damn silly

982
00:45:32,460 --> 00:45:28,420
and I think Steve look he's a

983
00:45:35,580 --> 00:45:32,470
charismatic speaker he gets around a lot

984
00:45:40,400 --> 00:45:35,590
there's a lot of talks makes a lot of

985
00:45:43,260 --> 00:45:40,410
money I guess but I don't consider him

986
00:45:44,940 --> 00:45:43,270
he doesn't do the kind of research we're

987
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:44,950
talking about he doesn't go to the

988
00:45:51,090 --> 00:45:48,490
archives to check on documents dig out

989
00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:51,100
the goodies if you will painstaking

990
00:45:54,630 --> 00:45:52,810
though it may be and frustrating though

991
00:45:59,160 --> 00:45:54,640
it may be but when you fling something

992
00:46:01,980 --> 00:45:59,170
Wow he did have some documents he

993
00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:01,990
disclosed from his meeting with the CIA

994
00:46:07,380 --> 00:46:04,810
director that I thought were significant

995
00:46:11,310 --> 00:46:07,390
no matter how you spin that I thought

996
00:46:12,960 --> 00:46:11,320
that well remember they had lunch

997
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:12,970
together he made it sound like he was

998
00:46:18,540 --> 00:46:16,090
briefing him I don't know if those guys

999
00:46:20,010 --> 00:46:18,550
I mean his claim and and I think he has

1000
00:46:21,690 --> 00:46:20,020
some merit again I don't know what to

1001
00:46:24,750 --> 00:46:21,700
make of my I just want to hear your

1002
00:46:27,720 --> 00:46:24,760
opinion of it but you know to sit down

1003
00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:27,730
with somebody for two hours and you take

1004
00:46:31,860 --> 00:46:29,290
a presentation for two

1005
00:46:34,200 --> 00:46:31,870
hours and say gee that was lunch when

1006
00:46:36,180 --> 00:46:34,210
he's talking about you know here's

1007
00:46:38,220 --> 00:46:36,190
everything well I hadn't didn't hear

1008
00:46:41,340 --> 00:46:38,230
that it was two hours I heard there was

1009
00:46:43,830 --> 00:46:41,350
much shorter than that but I don't know

1010
00:46:47,160 --> 00:46:43,840
and I don't have any good way to find

1011
00:46:48,540 --> 00:46:47,170
out I mean it could have stated but why

1012
00:46:50,870 --> 00:46:48,550
would you believe him if you think he

1013
00:46:54,450 --> 00:46:50,880
may be inclined to exaggerate

1014
00:47:00,150 --> 00:46:54,460
misrepresent overstate those are words I

1015
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:00,160
would use with regard to him and people

1016
00:47:05,550 --> 00:47:03,850
have never had a clearance don't seem to

1017
00:47:07,970 --> 00:47:05,560
understand that there are different ways

1018
00:47:10,230 --> 00:47:07,980
of thinking once you get it clearance

1019
00:47:13,590 --> 00:47:10,240
I'll tell you I'd about the healthy

1020
00:47:15,720 --> 00:47:13,600
respect for security when I worked at GE

1021
00:47:17,730 --> 00:47:15,730
if you left the document this is a

1022
00:47:21,090 --> 00:47:17,740
closed facility mind you guards at the

1023
00:47:24,030 --> 00:47:21,100
door you needed a clearance that fancy

1024
00:47:26,010 --> 00:47:24,040
badge that you were tired but if they

1025
00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:26,020
and the guards would go through the

1026
00:47:30,030 --> 00:47:28,570
facility at night if they found the

1027
00:47:33,750 --> 00:47:30,040
clasp of my document out you'd get a

1028
00:47:36,170 --> 00:47:33,760
call at 10 o'clock at night mr. Jones we

1029
00:47:39,240 --> 00:47:36,180
found a classified document on your desk

1030
00:47:43,710 --> 00:47:39,250
please come in and inventory all your

1031
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:43,720
documents not that's not a fun procedure

1032
00:47:47,730 --> 00:47:45,970
and if it happens twice here in real

1033
00:47:51,780 --> 00:47:47,740
trouble and three times you're probably

1034
00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:51,790
out alright so you develop a very

1035
00:47:56,340 --> 00:47:54,610
healthy respect one one time let me

1036
00:47:58,260 --> 00:47:56,350
remember this I was going to give a

1037
00:48:00,810 --> 00:47:58,270
classified talk at a conference on

1038
00:48:03,030 --> 00:48:00,820
radiation shielding and for some reason

1039
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:03,040
my slides didn't get finished I prepared

1040
00:48:06,090 --> 00:48:04,210
all the material but they weren't

1041
00:48:08,730 --> 00:48:06,100
finished by the time the regular courier

1042
00:48:10,260 --> 00:48:08,740
we're supposed to go so Stan okay you

1043
00:48:14,100 --> 00:48:10,270
have a need to know for this material

1044
00:48:16,260 --> 00:48:14,110
obviously you developed it so we can

1045
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:16,270
make you a courier and they sat me down

1046
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:18,490
and all the rules you know the slides

1047
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:20,530
don't go in the trunk of the car in your

1048
00:48:25,350 --> 00:48:23,050
briefcase they go with you in the car

1049
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:25,360
with your briefcase and a whole bunch of

1050
00:48:29,400 --> 00:48:26,770
other things I'll tell you I was never

1051
00:48:33,350 --> 00:48:29,410
so glad to get rid of stuff for the

1052
00:48:36,540 --> 00:48:33,360
other end I mean really aggravating

1053
00:48:38,250 --> 00:48:36,550
because they're scaring you you know and

1054
00:48:40,860 --> 00:48:38,260
the whole tone was we don't give a damn

1055
00:48:43,170 --> 00:48:40,870
value we care about your classified

1056
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:43,180
material

1057
00:48:48,510 --> 00:48:46,330
and so you have to recognize it okay

1058
00:48:50,490 --> 00:48:48,520
they don't care about me I got to be

1059
00:48:52,800 --> 00:48:50,500
careful what I'm doing because they're

1060
00:48:54,780 --> 00:48:52,810
going to come after me with all hell

1061
00:48:57,260 --> 00:48:54,790
break loose if they just got arrived on

1062
00:49:03,060 --> 00:48:57,270
something that doesn't follow the rules

1063
00:49:04,800 --> 00:49:03,070
so it it upped my understanding of the

1064
00:49:11,850 --> 00:49:04,810
terror that's used to keep people in

1065
00:49:14,490 --> 00:49:11,860
line if I could put you know so you

1066
00:49:15,660 --> 00:49:14,500
mentioned somebody else Steve and well

1067
00:49:18,300 --> 00:49:15,670
the other person I thought we should

1068
00:49:21,450 --> 00:49:18,310
kind of bring to the fore and see what

1069
00:49:25,110 --> 00:49:21,460
you think is Tom DeLonge getting a ton

1070
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:25,120
of press lately and very strange in my

1071
00:49:29,820 --> 00:49:27,370
opinion in terms of how that's being

1072
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:29,830
rolled out of course he's the former

1073
00:49:34,920 --> 00:49:31,930
frontman for blink-182

1074
00:49:37,230 --> 00:49:34,930
has expressed an interest in UFOs for

1075
00:49:40,260 --> 00:49:37,240
the last 10 years has had all these

1076
00:49:44,180 --> 00:49:40,270
associations was closely associated with

1077
00:49:48,810 --> 00:49:44,190
John Podesta who has some very deep

1078
00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:48,820
troubling connections to some other kind

1079
00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:51,370
of nasty stuff but now here we are

1080
00:49:59,370 --> 00:49:56,770
in mid late 2017 and DeLong has this big

1081
00:50:02,490 --> 00:49:59,380
big announcement that's coming out

1082
00:50:04,860 --> 00:50:02,500
supposedly in its technology center

1083
00:50:07,380 --> 00:50:04,870
which always kind of throws me for a

1084
00:50:10,530 --> 00:50:07,390
loop but jump in there what do you think

1085
00:50:13,520 --> 00:50:10,540
about Tom DeLonge well I read most of

1086
00:50:20,790 --> 00:50:13,530
his book I got a big fat book out there

1087
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:20,800
and I I won't say he's not sincere and I

1088
00:50:25,260 --> 00:50:23,410
won't say he hasn't met with a bunch of

1089
00:50:29,550 --> 00:50:25,270
these people who are in the need to know

1090
00:50:33,210 --> 00:50:29,560
the world but how much we can I have no

1091
00:50:35,700 --> 00:50:33,220
independent means of checking about

1092
00:50:39,150 --> 00:50:35,710
whether he's feeding us garbage that

1093
00:50:42,300 --> 00:50:39,160
somebody fed him right to confuse the

1094
00:50:44,580 --> 00:50:42,310
world you know so that the New York

1095
00:50:47,970 --> 00:50:44,590
Times can dismiss it if you will what

1096
00:50:51,270 --> 00:50:47,980
kind of thing I don't know I that was a

1097
00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:51,280
surprise hearing about Tom and seeing

1098
00:50:55,320 --> 00:50:53,170
how thick his book is and how many

1099
00:50:56,420 --> 00:50:55,330
people were jumping on the bandwagon so

1100
00:50:58,370 --> 00:50:56,430
to speak

1101
00:51:00,890 --> 00:50:58,380
not the first guy you'd think of as

1102
00:51:02,870 --> 00:51:00,900
being concerned with UFOs and again he

1103
00:51:06,680 --> 00:51:02,880
didn't have a security clearance far as

1104
00:51:08,210 --> 00:51:06,690
I know no indication that he did and I

1105
00:51:11,450 --> 00:51:08,220
wonder if he really understands how

1106
00:51:14,690 --> 00:51:11,460
security works but in other words is

1107
00:51:17,630 --> 00:51:14,700
this disinformation off to the side to

1108
00:51:20,569 --> 00:51:17,640
create confusion so people stay away

1109
00:51:25,069 --> 00:51:20,579
from the good stuff that's a sensible

1110
00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:25,079
procedure you know why not just inform

1111
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:27,450
you know but one thing I want to throw

1112
00:51:31,489 --> 00:51:28,890
out there and get your opinion on

1113
00:51:33,769 --> 00:51:31,499
because again I come at this whole thing

1114
00:51:36,380 --> 00:51:33,779
from a totally different perspective my

1115
00:51:38,960 --> 00:51:36,390
main interest is consciousness science

1116
00:51:41,059 --> 00:51:38,970
so we study near-death experience size

1117
00:51:43,370 --> 00:51:41,069
phenomena last time I had you on if I'd

1118
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:43,380
you did a marvelous job of connecting us

1119
00:51:47,660 --> 00:51:45,450
to the Betty and Barney Hill case and

1120
00:51:50,599 --> 00:51:47,670
how that leads right into some of this

1121
00:51:52,190 --> 00:51:50,609
extended consciousness stuff that again

1122
00:51:55,130 --> 00:51:52,200
no one ever gives you credit for they

1123
00:51:57,499 --> 00:51:55,140
always say oh stands the nuts-and-bolts

1124
00:51:59,839 --> 00:51:57,509
saucer guy and that's all he knows and

1125
00:52:01,789 --> 00:51:59,849
that hasn't been my experience but let's

1126
00:52:04,249 --> 00:52:01,799
leave that aside for a minute and I'll

1127
00:52:07,279 --> 00:52:04,259
tell you when I hear somebody talk about

1128
00:52:10,460 --> 00:52:07,289
UFOs and they lead with and lean too

1129
00:52:13,640 --> 00:52:10,470
heavily on the technology component I'm

1130
00:52:16,729 --> 00:52:13,650
always a little bit leery I mean we're

1131
00:52:19,130 --> 00:52:16,739
talking about information that would

1132
00:52:21,650 --> 00:52:19,140
completely change our understanding of

1133
00:52:24,589 --> 00:52:21,660
who we are where we came from why we're

1134
00:52:26,720 --> 00:52:24,599
here and then you're gonna lead with oh

1135
00:52:29,660 --> 00:52:26,730
and it's gonna be free energy for your

1136
00:52:32,630 --> 00:52:29,670
car I mean it may be every energy but

1137
00:52:35,539 --> 00:52:32,640
the social implications are so much

1138
00:52:38,930 --> 00:52:35,549
bigger I do always feel like I'm being

1139
00:52:41,150 --> 00:52:38,940
distracted and I don't know I agree with

1140
00:52:43,849 --> 00:52:41,160
you I agree with you that there are a

1141
00:52:45,799 --> 00:52:43,859
lot of distractions out there and tech

1142
00:52:48,559 --> 00:52:45,809
now I'm keep telling people when I have

1143
00:52:50,900 --> 00:52:48,569
a chance God I'm convinced that the

1144
00:52:53,120 --> 00:52:50,910
aliens know I hacked a lot more about

1145
00:52:56,539 --> 00:52:53,130
the crazy stuff if you will

1146
00:52:59,539 --> 00:52:56,549
near-death experience is a mental

1147
00:53:01,279 --> 00:52:59,549
telepathy you know stuff like that that

1148
00:53:03,229 --> 00:53:01,289
the rest of the scientific community

1149
00:53:05,479 --> 00:53:03,239
doesn't want to deal with in general

1150
00:53:09,770 --> 00:53:05,489
there are a few guys who got guts but

1151
00:53:13,270 --> 00:53:09,780
not many and I'm convinced

1152
00:53:15,530 --> 00:53:13,280
that there is a lot we don't know and

1153
00:53:17,180 --> 00:53:15,540
part of it is because it's our

1154
00:53:22,130 --> 00:53:17,190
unwillingness to admit that we don't

1155
00:53:24,620 --> 00:53:22,140
know we're smart guys you know we know

1156
00:53:31,220 --> 00:53:24,630
what's going on don't we and frequently

1157
00:53:33,950 --> 00:53:31,230
the answer is no so I'm I don't think we

1158
00:53:36,920 --> 00:53:33,960
spend enough time looking at the

1159
00:53:39,440 --> 00:53:36,930
non-conventional aspect of UFO

1160
00:53:42,080 --> 00:53:39,450
technology if you will if you consider I

1161
00:53:44,690 --> 00:53:42,090
mean look how does a guy go through a

1162
00:53:47,090 --> 00:53:44,700
wall you know go through a window

1163
00:53:49,850 --> 00:53:47,100
without breaking the glass I don't know

1164
00:53:53,330 --> 00:53:49,860
how to do those things and that's weird

1165
00:53:54,650 --> 00:53:53,340
it's important you know it tells us that

1166
00:53:57,580 --> 00:53:54,660
there's a lot going on that we don't

1167
00:53:59,990 --> 00:53:57,590
know about but I'm in a sense

1168
00:54:01,970 --> 00:54:00,000
considering the primitive society we

1169
00:54:04,670 --> 00:54:01,980
have on this point I mean let's not

1170
00:54:06,230 --> 00:54:04,680
forget we killed 50 million people

1171
00:54:12,590 --> 00:54:06,240
during World War two

1172
00:54:16,070 --> 00:54:12,600
we destroyed 1700 cities could anybody

1173
00:54:19,880 --> 00:54:16,080
say were a nice guy mm-hmm I mean who

1174
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:19,890
would want us out there and so I'm

1175
00:54:26,120 --> 00:54:24,210
convinced that there isn't evil use

1176
00:54:29,360 --> 00:54:26,130
could be made of a lot of this not just

1177
00:54:32,270 --> 00:54:29,370
the technology faster vehicles right

1178
00:54:35,840 --> 00:54:32,280
angle turns in all and soda stuff but

1179
00:54:39,070 --> 00:54:35,850
are these other things mental control of

1180
00:54:42,650 --> 00:54:39,080
others you know that scares me

1181
00:54:45,380 --> 00:54:42,660
let's kind of rule the roost here if we

1182
00:54:47,350 --> 00:54:45,390
give them half a chance Stan in general

1183
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:47,360
how do you feel about this

1184
00:54:51,170 --> 00:54:49,290
characterization that I hear over and

1185
00:54:53,090 --> 00:54:51,180
over again and I said to you in the

1186
00:54:55,790 --> 00:54:53,100
email that you know just recently I had

1187
00:54:58,520 --> 00:54:55,800
the chance to interview Robby Graham

1188
00:55:01,970 --> 00:54:58,530
about his new book UFOs reframing the

1189
00:55:03,890 --> 00:55:01,980
debate a book that again says hey we

1190
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:03,900
should be looking at this consciousness

1191
00:55:08,750 --> 00:55:06,930
model of UFOs I interviewed jock valet

1192
00:55:11,780 --> 00:55:08,760
maybe we can definitely talk more about

1193
00:55:13,850 --> 00:55:11,790
that if I can squeeze a few minutes when

1194
00:55:16,150 --> 00:55:13,860
I go through all those I continue to get

1195
00:55:20,360 --> 00:55:16,160
the characterization of Stan Freedman as

1196
00:55:21,830 --> 00:55:20,370
he's a guy who's just interested in nuts

1197
00:55:24,920 --> 00:55:21,840
and bolts and

1198
00:55:28,300 --> 00:55:24,930
the UFO field has moved on and it's

1199
00:55:31,520 --> 00:55:28,310
interested in experiences and

1200
00:55:34,430 --> 00:55:31,530
experiencers one how do you feel about

1201
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:34,440
both how you're being characterized

1202
00:55:40,130 --> 00:55:36,690
there and how the field is being

1203
00:55:44,150 --> 00:55:40,140
characterized and whether the field has

1204
00:55:45,890 --> 00:55:44,160
and should move from worrying about nuts

1205
00:55:49,460 --> 00:55:45,900
and bolts sightings and that kind of

1206
00:55:52,970 --> 00:55:49,470
stuff to being interested in experiences

1207
00:55:54,890 --> 00:55:52,980
and experiences look I'm co-author of

1208
00:55:59,090 --> 00:55:54,900
the book captured the Betty and Barney

1209
00:56:01,070 --> 00:55:59,100
Hill UFO experience and certainly

1210
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:01,080
convinced not only that the event took

1211
00:56:05,660 --> 00:56:03,410
place as described in the book but that

1212
00:56:09,530 --> 00:56:05,670
there's a lot going on there that isn't

1213
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:09,540
really conventional and so yeah I guess

1214
00:56:15,680 --> 00:56:11,610
people call it a nuts and bolts guy some

1215
00:56:18,590 --> 00:56:15,690
people might just say plain nuts but I'm

1216
00:56:23,210 --> 00:56:18,600
convinced there is another aspect of the

1217
00:56:24,670 --> 00:56:23,220
phenomena that's very important not just

1218
00:56:27,380 --> 00:56:24,680
to Leppa thing

1219
00:56:29,780 --> 00:56:27,390
but being able to control other people

1220
00:56:31,970 --> 00:56:29,790
being able to exert control over parts

1221
00:56:34,360 --> 00:56:31,980
of the physics world physical world that

1222
00:56:37,850 --> 00:56:34,370
we don't really know how to deal with

1223
00:56:40,010 --> 00:56:37,860
like I say but I hear about people who

1224
00:56:41,890 --> 00:56:40,020
I've listened to tapes of people

1225
00:56:45,620 --> 00:56:41,900
reliving the experience of watching

1226
00:56:49,480 --> 00:56:45,630
aliens go through the walls and it's

1227
00:56:52,550 --> 00:56:49,490
scary I mean you know that's incredible

1228
00:56:54,260 --> 00:56:52,560
so I'm interested in that stuff but I

1229
00:56:56,720 --> 00:56:54,270
don't know what to do about that stuff

1230
00:56:59,870 --> 00:56:56,730
I'm a nuclear physicist okay I know what

1231
00:57:03,970 --> 00:56:59,880
to do about that but all this mental

1232
00:57:09,080 --> 00:57:03,980
stuff I find fascinating but again it's

1233
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:09,090
I'm in physics not psychology yeah Stan

1234
00:57:11,900 --> 00:57:10,770
what do you think what do you think of

1235
00:57:15,080 --> 00:57:11,910
Jacques Vallee

1236
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:15,090
I enjoyed the opportunity to interview

1237
00:57:19,970 --> 00:57:17,370
him just recently he's kind of made the

1238
00:57:24,020 --> 00:57:19,980
rounds again I think he has some really

1239
00:57:27,650 --> 00:57:24,030
interesting things to say then I love to

1240
00:57:30,050 --> 00:57:27,660
juxtapose those with some of your

1241
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:30,060
thoughts and comments but first what do

1242
00:57:35,240 --> 00:57:32,370
you think of him in general you've had I

1243
00:57:38,540 --> 00:57:35,250
like him I've been in his

1244
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:38,550
place in San Francisco I see him at

1245
00:57:42,590 --> 00:57:40,770
conferences from time to time and we

1246
00:57:46,070 --> 00:57:42,600
seem to get along very well

1247
00:57:48,260 --> 00:57:46,080
I won't characterize how he thinks to me

1248
00:57:50,510 --> 00:57:48,270
because I don't know but we seem to have

1249
00:57:54,560 --> 00:57:50,520
hit it off pretty well I think he's a

1250
00:57:56,450 --> 00:57:54,570
very bright guy and you know he suffers

1251
00:58:00,380 --> 00:57:56,460
from association with astronomers what

1252
00:58:02,390 --> 00:58:00,390
can I say well astronomers you know

1253
00:58:04,940 --> 00:58:02,400
don't know anything about deep space

1254
00:58:07,040 --> 00:58:04,950
travel they don't know anything about

1255
00:58:07,550 --> 00:58:07,050
security in general it's nothing like

1256
00:58:10,430 --> 00:58:07,560
that

1257
00:58:12,800 --> 00:58:10,440
so they're cut off from an important

1258
00:58:15,530 --> 00:58:12,810
part of the UFO world but I think

1259
00:58:18,410 --> 00:58:15,540
Jacques has done a great deal he's

1260
00:58:21,500 --> 00:58:18,420
written several interesting books and

1261
00:58:25,460 --> 00:58:21,510
he's quite good at getting people

1262
00:58:27,050 --> 00:58:25,470
interested in what's going on but coming

1263
00:58:31,070 --> 00:58:27,060
at it from an entirely different side of

1264
00:58:35,030 --> 00:58:31,080
the world than I am in most senses you

1265
00:58:37,220 --> 00:58:35,040
know yeah I'm nuts and bolts okay no I

1266
00:58:39,520 --> 00:58:37,230
think he's one of our leading lights I

1267
00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:39,530
mean he's getting old so am i you know

1268
00:58:44,210 --> 00:58:42,450
but and he's been around a long time and

1269
00:58:46,220 --> 00:58:44,220
I give him credit for sticking to it I

1270
00:58:48,770 --> 00:58:46,230
give you credit for sticking to it and I

1271
00:58:50,840 --> 00:58:48,780
think you don't get enough credit I mean

1272
00:58:54,020 --> 00:58:50,850
look at this we've been going at it for

1273
00:58:57,290 --> 00:58:54,030
an hour you are on is top of your game

1274
00:58:59,420 --> 00:58:57,300
as you were the last time I talked to

1275
00:59:01,670 --> 00:58:59,430
you five years ago and I can go listen

1276
00:59:04,580 --> 00:59:01,680
to an interview with you 15 years ago

1277
00:59:08,330 --> 00:59:04,590
you're moving forward you're on top of

1278
00:59:09,650 --> 00:59:08,340
the issues III I think that's fantastic

1279
00:59:23,740 --> 00:59:09,660
I think it's a you're a fantastic

1280
00:59:29,000 --> 00:59:27,560
anticipate it's the truth it's the truth

1281
00:59:32,780 --> 00:59:29,010
but let me let me come let me tie that

1282
00:59:35,960 --> 00:59:32,790
let me tie that to valet because I found

1283
00:59:37,700 --> 00:59:35,970
and and to my surprise and I think a lot

1284
00:59:38,090 --> 00:59:37,710
of people were looking for something

1285
00:59:41,810 --> 00:59:38,100
else

1286
00:59:45,170 --> 00:59:41,820
I found a lot of similarities in where

1287
00:59:48,050 --> 00:59:45,180
Jacques Vallee is today with some of the

1288
00:59:49,420 --> 00:59:48,060
things that you're expressing one valet

1289
00:59:57,630 --> 00:59:49,430
underst

1290
01:00:01,210 --> 00:59:57,640
that you know maybe as troublesome as

1291
01:00:04,000 --> 01:00:01,220
misinformation and deception is that

1292
01:00:06,340 --> 01:00:04,010
it's part of the package and conspiracy

1293
01:00:08,740 --> 01:00:06,350
comes with the territory and you know he

1294
01:00:10,690 --> 01:00:08,750
also was a venture capitalist in Silicon

1295
01:00:12,550 --> 01:00:10,700
Valley you can't be a venture capitalist

1296
01:00:14,410 --> 01:00:12,560
in Silicon Valley and that be knee-deep

1297
01:00:18,180 --> 01:00:14,420
in conspiracy every day that's your

1298
01:00:24,730 --> 01:00:21,900
but also just on in terms of you know

1299
01:00:27,010 --> 01:00:24,740
you ask valet and and again you know

1300
01:00:28,810 --> 01:00:27,020
people ask him about MUFON you know and

1301
01:00:30,880 --> 01:00:28,820
again he's misunderstood as somebody who

1302
01:00:32,200 --> 01:00:30,890
says oh we should move past sightings

1303
01:00:34,480 --> 01:00:32,210
and all the rest this he says the

1304
01:00:37,000 --> 01:00:34,490
opposite he says oh no that's important

1305
01:00:40,150 --> 01:00:37,010
work we should continue all that work so

1306
01:00:43,240 --> 01:00:40,160
I see him as somebody who has one foot

1307
01:00:46,000 --> 01:00:43,250
firmly planted in the nuts and bolts if

1308
01:00:48,940 --> 01:00:46,010
you will because that's the data that we

1309
01:00:51,850 --> 01:00:48,950
can at least kind of get our arms around

1310
01:00:54,520 --> 01:00:51,860
a little bit and another foot in this

1311
01:00:56,710 --> 01:00:54,530
big question mark area the mental

1312
01:00:59,890 --> 01:00:56,720
phenomenon part that you're kind of

1313
01:01:01,810 --> 01:00:59,900
talking about and yeah I see him having

1314
01:01:04,840 --> 01:01:01,820
a the similar kind of balanced approach

1315
01:01:08,110 --> 01:01:04,850
only with an emphasis on maybe some

1316
01:01:10,360 --> 01:01:08,120
areas that he's more comfortable with in

1317
01:01:12,250 --> 01:01:10,370
terms of exploring on the mental and

1318
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:12,260
psychological side because he's chosen

1319
01:01:18,670 --> 01:01:16,010
to focus on that well I think I agree

1320
01:01:20,410 --> 01:01:18,680
with you and I think he's one of the

1321
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:20,420
leaders of the field he doesn't make a

1322
01:01:27,430 --> 01:01:22,850
lot of noise anymore in these days but

1323
01:01:29,200 --> 01:01:27,440
he shows up at conferences and I respect

1324
01:01:33,430 --> 01:01:29,210
his opinions I don't say that about

1325
01:01:38,200 --> 01:01:33,440
everybody the truth so Jacques is a good

1326
01:01:41,530 --> 01:01:38,210
person as far as I'm concerned what do

1327
01:01:45,610 --> 01:01:41,540
you make in in a more broad sense about

1328
01:01:48,340 --> 01:01:45,620
where the UFO field seems to be heading

1329
01:01:50,950 --> 01:01:48,350
and I know that's a really general term

1330
01:01:53,850 --> 01:01:50,960
but I mentioned a minute ago that there

1331
01:01:57,070 --> 01:01:53,860
has been this move towards consciousness

1332
01:02:00,580 --> 01:01:57,080
attaching consciousness to UFOs and you

1333
01:02:03,070 --> 01:02:00,590
hear that as this kind of a a meme

1334
01:02:05,530 --> 01:02:03,080
do you what do you make of that in

1335
01:02:08,680 --> 01:02:05,540
general or what did you make of the

1336
01:02:12,100 --> 01:02:08,690
direction that the UFO community seems

1337
01:02:15,730 --> 01:02:12,110
to be heading in in other ways well I I

1338
01:02:18,100 --> 01:02:15,740
think we sometimes give the community to

1339
01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:18,110
make it in capital letters the community

1340
01:02:23,410 --> 01:02:21,050
right it's a whole bunch of little

1341
01:02:26,620 --> 01:02:23,420
people who have different views and

1342
01:02:30,460 --> 01:02:26,630
different purposes different reasons for

1343
01:02:32,830 --> 01:02:30,470
doing what they're doing I think one of

1344
01:02:35,170 --> 01:02:32,840
the things that's changed as I indicated

1345
01:02:37,630 --> 01:02:35,180
earlier is that we're now where they're

1346
01:02:40,390 --> 01:02:37,640
probably planets all over the place out

1347
01:02:42,940 --> 01:02:40,400
there and that changes things we're not

1348
01:02:47,740 --> 01:02:42,950
special you know we're not the only ones

1349
01:02:51,700 --> 01:02:47,750
and I think you know I hate to keep

1350
01:02:54,670 --> 01:02:51,710
reminding people that if you're into

1351
01:02:57,640 --> 01:02:54,680
nuclear fusion you're into deep space

1352
01:02:59,230 --> 01:02:57,650
travel as well as destruction and people

1353
01:03:02,020 --> 01:02:59,240
are shocked when I say we have exploded

1354
01:03:04,180 --> 01:03:02,030
mm a clear weapons on this planet people

1355
01:03:07,150 --> 01:03:04,190
look at me what do you mean Stan yeah

1356
01:03:09,490 --> 01:03:07,160
that's right look it up mm nuclear

1357
01:03:11,530 --> 01:03:09,500
weapons that would tell anybody in the

1358
01:03:15,040 --> 01:03:11,540
neighborhood that we're capable if we

1359
01:03:19,450 --> 01:03:15,050
choose to do so to go out and bother

1360
01:03:21,940 --> 01:03:19,460
them and that's a you know a serious

1361
01:03:25,020 --> 01:03:21,950
notion gonna watch out for those damn

1362
01:03:27,850 --> 01:03:25,030
Earthlings you know they're bad guys

1363
01:03:30,640 --> 01:03:27,860
they had no qualms about building

1364
01:03:33,070 --> 01:03:30,650
weapons of mass destruction all right

1365
01:03:34,660 --> 01:03:33,080
and without seeming to be concerned

1366
01:03:36,310 --> 01:03:34,670
about helping the people live a better

1367
01:03:38,710 --> 01:03:36,320
life you know improving the status of

1368
01:03:41,890 --> 01:03:38,720
the planet and all that sort of stuff so

1369
01:03:46,030 --> 01:03:41,900
I think there are some aspects here that

1370
01:03:47,710 --> 01:03:46,040
we need to do more looking at and I

1371
01:03:51,270 --> 01:03:47,720
think some people who want to move away

1372
01:03:54,450 --> 01:03:51,280
from nuts and bolts are forgetting that

1373
01:03:58,240 --> 01:03:54,460
they're an important part of our society

1374
01:03:59,530 --> 01:03:58,250
you know when I show people slides of an

1375
01:04:02,350 --> 01:03:59,540
aircraft carrier nuclear-powered

1376
01:04:04,300 --> 01:04:02,360
aircraft carrier and point out that you

1377
01:04:07,300 --> 01:04:04,310
realize that this big ol monsters

1378
01:04:12,210 --> 01:04:07,310
thousand feet long 1,100 feet long can

1379
01:04:14,190 --> 01:04:12,220
operate for 18 years without refueling

1380
01:04:17,460 --> 01:04:14,200
people look at me what

1381
01:04:20,970 --> 01:04:17,470
I said yeah 18 years that makes a

1382
01:04:25,050 --> 01:04:20,980
difference if somebody's got that kind

1383
01:04:26,730 --> 01:04:25,060
of capability and it's there more than

1384
01:04:30,390 --> 01:04:26,740
one country has built-in the comparator

1385
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:30,400
crackers so there is technology there

1386
01:04:35,310 --> 01:04:33,250
that cannot be sneezed at

1387
01:04:36,300 --> 01:04:35,320
you know if you're a ship captain some

1388
01:04:38,099 --> 01:04:36,310
bees are getting to worry about

1389
01:04:41,069 --> 01:04:38,109
refueling in Philly ten years from now

1390
01:04:43,200 --> 01:04:41,079
he says what I thought I have to worry

1391
01:04:47,970 --> 01:04:43,210
after a few months maybe out on the

1392
01:04:51,410 --> 01:04:47,980
ocean so I I think there are things here

1393
01:04:55,500 --> 01:04:51,420
that need to be taken into consideration

1394
01:04:58,680 --> 01:04:55,510
attitudes about killing people about

1395
01:05:01,829 --> 01:04:58,690
being decent to people about learning

1396
01:05:04,050 --> 01:05:01,839
about our local neighborhood we have not

1397
01:05:07,680 --> 01:05:04,060
made a real effort to do that as far as

1398
01:05:09,630 --> 01:05:07,690
I'm concerned and I wish we would and

1399
01:05:12,680 --> 01:05:09,640
that that's not just the nuts and bolts

1400
01:05:15,690 --> 01:05:12,690
oh I'm talking about the mental stuff

1401
01:05:17,099 --> 01:05:15,700
which i think is very exciting but I

1402
01:05:20,569 --> 01:05:17,109
don't pretend to be an expert at that

1403
01:05:25,290 --> 01:05:20,579
I'm a physicist you know what can I say

1404
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:25,300
well I think you can say quite a bit you

1405
01:05:30,270 --> 01:05:27,130
have said it and I certainly appreciate

1406
01:05:32,910 --> 01:05:30,280
it Stan tell folks what you're up to

1407
01:05:36,540 --> 01:05:32,920
nowadays where they can find out more

1408
01:05:39,839 --> 01:05:36,550
about what your have done and what you

1409
01:05:42,630 --> 01:05:39,849
continue to do well the easiest way it

1410
01:05:46,770 --> 01:05:42,640
is to go to my website triple w dot

1411
01:05:50,099 --> 01:05:46,780
Stanton Friedman dot-com that's Fri e DM

1412
01:05:52,140 --> 01:05:50,109
aen comm and that lists from my books it

1413
01:05:55,160 --> 01:05:52,150
says forthcoming I'll be giving a talk

1414
01:05:58,650 --> 01:05:55,170
in Little Rock Arkansas in a three weeks

1415
01:06:00,990 --> 01:05:58,660
I'll be a new fun of course I'll be

1416
01:06:05,940 --> 01:06:01,000
talking in Eureka Springs Arkansas in

1417
01:06:07,440 --> 01:06:05,950
April after that I don't know it's the

1418
01:06:10,890 --> 01:06:07,450
first year or I haven't had a lot of

1419
01:06:12,420 --> 01:06:10,900
bookings inches well into the future and

1420
01:06:14,900 --> 01:06:12,430
I'm not trying to cut them while getting

1421
01:06:18,900 --> 01:06:14,910
old it's getting more difficult you know

1422
01:06:20,700 --> 01:06:18,910
and I haven't yet talked about writing

1423
01:06:23,640 --> 01:06:20,710
another book Cathleen Martin and I have

1424
01:06:26,220 --> 01:06:23,650
done three books which I enjoyed working

1425
01:06:27,510 --> 01:06:26,230
with her different viewpoint but very

1426
01:06:30,300 --> 01:06:27,520
bright

1427
01:06:34,170 --> 01:06:30,310
sharp so you know maybe it's time to

1428
01:06:39,690 --> 01:06:34,180
write another book maybe a personal book

1429
01:06:42,840 --> 01:06:39,700
I don't know but I'm enjoying giant

1430
01:06:44,370 --> 01:06:42,850
being old in the sense that I am still

1431
01:06:49,010 --> 01:06:44,380
able to get around I'm still able to

1432
01:06:54,360 --> 01:06:49,020
think I haven't given in to Mr Al Shimer

1433
01:06:56,760 --> 01:06:54,370
yet I won't guarantee that so if they

1434
01:07:00,270 --> 01:06:56,770
look at my website all the books I send

1435
01:07:02,280 --> 01:07:00,280
out I autograph personally I'm a one-man

1436
01:07:04,190 --> 01:07:02,290
operation I don't have a system to do

1437
01:07:08,280 --> 01:07:04,200
all this stuff

1438
01:07:10,500 --> 01:07:08,290
maybe that's what keeps me younger doing

1439
01:07:14,280 --> 01:07:10,510
my thing I'll be celebrating my 84th

1440
01:07:22,460 --> 01:07:14,290
birthday in July me and Benito Mussolini

1441
01:07:27,960 --> 01:07:25,500
reaches grouping there it's been

1442
01:07:31,950 --> 01:07:27,970
absolutely great having him on please

1443
01:07:35,070 --> 01:07:31,960
allow me if I need to to call on you in

1444
01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:35,080
anything I refer me to refresh something

1445
01:07:40,260 --> 01:07:37,450
and bring us all up to date on what's

1446
01:07:44,790 --> 01:07:40,270
going on in this fascinating fascinating

1447
01:07:48,690 --> 01:07:44,800
world of UFO so thanks again my pleasure

1448
01:07:50,250 --> 01:07:48,700
I look forward to it thank you thanks

1449
01:07:52,020 --> 01:07:50,260
again to stay in Friedman for joining me

1450
01:07:55,520 --> 01:07:52,030
today on skeptic oh I guess the one

1451
01:07:58,880 --> 01:07:55,530
question i tee up from this interview is

1452
01:08:03,630 --> 01:07:58,890
should we be looking at the

1453
01:08:08,460 --> 01:08:03,640
consciousness linked to UFOs for more of

1454
01:08:12,270 --> 01:08:08,470
a technology perspective is this yet

1455
01:08:15,690 --> 01:08:12,280
another thing that the aliens have

1456
01:08:18,450 --> 01:08:15,700
figured out how to do and that we can't

1457
01:08:21,660 --> 01:08:18,460
quite do yet but once we get there it's

1458
01:08:25,559 --> 01:08:21,670
all just a matter of engineering more or

1459
01:08:28,130 --> 01:08:25,569
less so and E's working in the astral

1460
01:08:30,690 --> 01:08:28,140
realm of psychedelics telepathy

1461
01:08:33,990 --> 01:08:30,700
certainly all that stuff maybe it's just

1462
01:08:36,450 --> 01:08:34,000
technology it's an interesting angle to

1463
01:08:38,490 --> 01:08:36,460
consider so let me know your thoughts on

1464
01:08:40,219 --> 01:08:38,500
that any way you want to reach me is

1465
01:08:42,559 --> 01:08:40,229
fine I

1466
01:08:45,079 --> 01:08:42,569
of course to always do the skeptical

1467
01:08:48,019 --> 01:08:45,089
form where you'll have the best chance

1468
01:08:50,629 --> 01:08:48,029
of giving getting an answer but anyway

1469
01:08:52,459 --> 01:08:50,639
you want to reach me is fine and of

1470
01:08:55,609 --> 01:08:52,469
course as always do check out the

1471
01:08:57,890 --> 01:08:55,619
skeptic Co website approaching four

1472
01:08:59,899 --> 01:08:57,900
hundred of these kind of interviews if

1473
01:09:03,140 --> 01:08:59,909
you like this one at all or if you like

1474
01:09:05,539 --> 01:09:03,150
consciousness science skepticism that

1475
01:09:07,699 --> 01:09:05,549
kind of stuff and kind of calling out

1476
01:09:09,469 --> 01:09:07,709
the pseudo scepticism that is so much a

1477
01:09:12,769 --> 01:09:09,479
part of science well then you'll

1478
01:09:15,199 --> 01:09:12,779
probably like skeptic oh so do check it

1479
01:09:17,089 --> 01:09:15,209
out I have some great shows coming up do

1480
01:09:19,380 --> 01:09:17,099
stick around for all of that until next

1481
01:09:27,200 --> 01:09:19,390
time take care bye for now

1482
01:09:38,610 --> 01:09:34,230
[Music]

1483
01:09:40,470 --> 01:09:38,620
so thanks for watching this video if it

1484
01:09:43,080 --> 01:09:40,480
wasn't really a video but just an audio

1485
01:09:44,640 --> 01:09:43,090
stored as a video well I apologize but

1486
01:09:46,620 --> 01:09:44,650
there's more videos out there as well

1487
01:09:48,420 --> 01:09:46,630
but please check out the skeptical

1488
01:09:49,770 --> 01:09:48,430
website you can see it here we cover a

1489
01:09:52,590 --> 01:09:49,780
lot of different stuff you might be

1490
01:09:55,920 --> 01:09:52,600
interested in relating to controversial

1491
01:09:59,340 --> 01:09:55,930
science and spirituality a lot of shows

1492
01:10:02,340 --> 01:09:59,350
up there over 350 of them or so all free

1493
01:10:03,800 --> 01:10:02,350
all available for download so do check